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By Nicholas Horton | July 24th 2009 03:05 PM | 11 comments | Print | E-mail | Track Comments
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About Nicholas Horton

I'm a graduate student in mathematics at Portland State University. My areas of study are Quantum Game theory and Mathematical Biology with a focus in Evolution.

Outside of Math, my science interests... Full Bio

Two New Guinea men, Henep Isum Mandingo and Hup Daniel Wemp, have filed a $10 million defamation  suit against the New Yorker and Jared Diamond for a story the New Yorker printed called “Annals of Anthropology: Vengeance Is Ours: What can tribal societies tell us about our need to get even?“, that recounts a series of revenge killings committed by Wemp:

In 1992, when Daniel Wemp was about twenty-two years old, his beloved paternal uncle Soll was killed in a battle against the neighboring Ombal clan… And Soll had been very good to Daniel, who recalled him as a tall and handsome man, destined to become a leader. Soll’s death demanded vengeance… As it turned out, it took three years, twenty-nine more killings, and the sacrifice of three hundred pigs before Daniel succeeded in discharging this responsibility.


The two men dispute Diamonds account and say they’ve never been involved in any revenge killings.

jared_diamond

Jared Diamond, the Pulitzer prize winning author of Guns, Germs, and Steel, has written extensively on the reasons he believes some societies have grown rich over the centuries (like the Europeans and their descendants) and others have not (like the tribal peoples of New Guinea).

His goal has been to make the subject of History more scientific.  In the introduction to a talk with Jared Diamond, John Brockman said:


Historians don’t get training in the scientific methods; they don’t get training in statistics; they don’t get training in the experimental method or problems of doing experiments on historical subjects; and they’ll often say that history is not a science, history is closer to an art.

Jared comes to this question as one who is accomplished in two scientific areas: physiology and evolutionary biology. The first is a laboratory science; the second, is never far from history. “Biology is the science,” he says. “Evolution is the concept that makes biology unique.”


But, did Diamond tell the truth?  The New Yorker is standing by him.  I think a more important question is not whether he got his facts exactly right, whether the two men are simply embarrassed to be known worldwide as killers, or whether Diamond simply made the whole thing up; rather the more important question is whether his story rings true to anthropologists who work with tribal societies, and other scientists who look for evidence of the origins of war

There is a tendency among educated people to presume that war is a modern invention, that it’s the fault of religion, capitalism, oppression, etc.  The tendency is to believe that somewhere in our distant past our ancestors were “noble savages”, living in a Garden of Eden, at peace with the land, and at peace with each other.

That view is a fantasy.  Of course, the proximate causes for violence and warfare are always things we can easily point our fingers at like the above mentioned religion, economics, oppression, etc.  But, the ultimate causes are far more innately human.

There is ample research (see here, herehere, here, and here to start) showing that tribal societies, both current and in the past, engaged massive violence (whether we choose to call it war or not).   Where these tendencies came from is a hot topic of research as well.   Professor Napoleon Chagnon, of UC Santa Barbara, wrote of the Yanomamö Indians of the Amazon:


Demographic data indicate that men who have killed have more wives and offspring than men who have not killed.


So was war/violence beneficial?  Did those groups that engaged in war out-compete those that didn’t?  Did sexual selection promote war?  Is the data on war over hyped?  These are among the interesting questions that need answering.

I don’t think Jared Diamond lied.  He may have gotten his facts wrong.  Even more likely, he just angered some people who would have prefered to not have their stories told to the world.  But, his story fits the evidence in the broader sense:  We humans have always been violent and prone to revenge and tribal societies are not immune to the pull of human nature.



Comments

You write: "rather the more important question is whether his story rings true to anthropologists who work with tribal societies, and other scientists who look for evidence of the origins of war."

Do so-called primitive people have less human rights than you or me? Would it ever be okay for me to say --since, in general, murders happen where you live frequently, I can, without speaking with you, or finding any police or court records, state, as fact, that you are a leader of killers and hired people to kill others?

Of course that is not okay. You could sue me for libel. This is exactly the scenario for Daniel Wemp and Isum Mandingo face. I know because I have done the research . See http://www.stinkyjournalism.org/latest-journalism-news-updates-149.php

Sadly, the famed fact checkers at the New Yorker never called Isum or Daniel to check facts--they did not call police, government officials, missionaries and anthropologist who live there and know these men and tribes for many years. They know the history of the area and they know Diamond's hateful story libels innocent tribes and two tribesmen.

Diamond admits to Science magazine that Daniel was his single source and he only had note from one two hour meeting in 2006. No tape recordings. Ask yourself what student --let alone esteemed scientist-- would ever write up an unpublished war with one source and not fact check?

Think about it. Under what circumstances would you write up a complex war and do zero fact checking? Only one I can think of-- when you fabricate something. You surly don't fact check something you know isn't true because you know you made it up!

Steve Davis's picture
We humans have always been violent and prone to revenge
That's a big call Nick. History will always be dominated by conflict and chaos, because those events stick in the mind and are more likely to be the topics of discussion before, during and after they occur. No-one will feel inclined to write a history or develop an oral history based on a century of peace, but as soon as a war that lasts a few weeks comes along, it becomes the stuff of legend. 

Gerhard Adam's picture
There is a tendency among educated people to presume that war is a
modern invention, that it’s the fault of religion, capitalism,
oppression, etc.  The tendency is to believe that somewhere in our
distant past our ancestors were “noble savages”, living in a Garden of
Eden, at peace with the land, and at peace with each other.

War IS a modern invention, since it is physically impossible for tribal societies to engage in protracted engagements.  They certainly would've engaged in battles and skirmishes, but "war" is most definitely an artifact of civilization.  One of the most notable examples of this, is the U.S. conflict with Native American Indians.  The U.S. could field a professional military, whereas Native Americans could engage in battles, but invariably they could never engage in a long conflict because they still had families to care for and responsibilities for dealing with their own survival.

Similarly, I find it disingenuous when I hear people talking as if tribal societies had the same cavalier attitude towards animals and nature as that evidenced by the modern city dweller.  This is patently false, since such tribal peoples absolutely depended on the natural world for their survival.  I'm not suggesting that they were "environmentalists", or lived in some Hollywood-like reverence of nature, but they most certainly were knowledgeable and respected the powers they actually had to contend with. 

I would agree that it is foolish to attribute some kind of "noble" attitude to tribal societies, because there's no reason to believe that they had any different personalities than we have today.  People would've been greedy and generous, selfish and altruistic, friendly and hostile.  All of the characteristics that mark people in general would have also been present in these societies. 

However, there are too many significant radical differences between tribal and modern societies to describe them in the same fashion.  I find that such references invariably are used to rationalize how our ineptness with nature is somehow justified if we can rationalize that primitive societies behaved similarly.

Gary Herstein's picture
War IS a modern invention

By the bye, John Keegan (who is certainly one of the leading military historians alive today) agrees with you. My copies of his books are all in storage, but the relevant text is A History of Warfare, Vintage; (November 1, 1994).

Gerhard Adam's picture
Thanks for the info. 

Nicholas Horton's picture
Gerhard,
I'm afraid the word "war" is a bit loaded and is ripe for confusion.  I should have clarified how i meant it used. 

If it is being used in the modern context (protracted violence with political motivations on a large scale) then it isn't appropriate here, certainly.  However, if we use it in a more general way (the way it is often used to describe animal behavior from wolves to chimps to ants) to include violence that includes a large number of one population engaging with a large number of another (both a part of the same species), then it does.  I would also include blood-feuds in the definition (which was the specific type of violence Jared Diamond wrote about).   It isn't a perfect definition, but with clarification, i think it works.

I certainly agree that the differences between modern societies and tribal societies is great.  However, if we are going to understand the roots of the human tendencies toward violent behaviors (so as to curb them), and the roots of large-scale conflict behaviors, we'll have to take a hard look at the behavior of tribal societies.  They represent a lot of what is good, and a lot of what is bad, about our natures.


Steve,
I don't disagree that violence takes up a larger share of our memories than does peace.  But, I think there is a strong evolutionary reason for that.  We can have 10 years of a happy peaceful existence, and then in one afternoon watch every last one of our family members be brutally killed (many human societies throughout time have dealt with this).  If you survive, and end up with a new family, you aren't likely to forget to keep on the lookout for it happening again and taking appropriate precautionary measures.   

Paying close attention to our worst side is not to downplay our best side.  It's a way to take seriously the fight to control our worst side.  To solve any problem, we first have to understand the facts of why it got that way. 

When I said:
We humans have always been violent and prone to revenge and tribal societies are not immune to the pull of human nature.


I didn't mean to say that we haven't ALSO always been altruistic, loving, and humane.  But, that's our problem isn't' it, we are (like most species) two sided.  Both loving and vengeful, embracing and xenophobic.

Nicholas Horton's picture
Rhonda,

I have no interest in accusing 2 people who I've never met of doing something we find horrible. 

When I said:
"... the more important question is whether his story rings true to
anthropologists who work with tribal societies, and other scientists
who look for evidence of the origins of war."

What I DID NOT mean to say was that if the story rang true in the abstract that it meant the 2 people in question actually did anything of the sort. 

The point was one of the underlying question of the origins of human violence--does it come from within our natures or is it purely a construct of modern society?  The story very well could have been made up fiction, but still be metaphorically relevant. 

Jared Diamond may have made it all up.  I don't know.  The jury is still out.  But, what I was writing about is not fundamentally whether he made up a story to defame the names of two men.  I was writing about how his story frames a larger sociobiological question and whether that story rings true as a metaphor for the early existence of human violence.

Steve Davis's picture
"Both loving and vengeful, embracing and xenophobic."

That's true Nick, but it's not the whole story. When presented that way it can be interpreted as a balance between those opposites, when the reality is that the overwhelming majority of people engage in cooperative behaviours for an overwhelming percentage of the time.

I think you might have brought to light an interesting point. Diamond might be making assumptions about humanity based on observations of an isolated sector. This can be misleading. Apparently there's groups of chimps, isolated geographically from each other, who display vastly different attitudes to cooperation.

Gerhard Adam's picture
However, if we are going to understand the roots of the human tendencies toward violent behaviors (so as to curb them), and the roots of large-scale conflict behaviors, we'll have to take a hard look at the behavior of tribal societies.

I can certainly understand your position.  I think where I have the problem (and it tends to get glossed over), is that in most animal societies and, I suspect, human societies, there may have been violent encounters, but generally they weren't protracted enough, nor intensive enough to have an objective of total annihilation. 

This isn't to say that there might not have been conflicts that rose to that level, but in general, unless there are severe resource conflicts, we tend to find that animals (and humans) limit their confrontation to minimize the liabilities of survival-threatening injuries for little gain.  In short, many violent encounters are more to maintain established boundaries, rather than for direct gain.  The marked difference in relatively modern society is the ability to field professional soldiers, so that there was a singular focus of war, with other specializations dealing with logistics and supply lines, etc.

In any animal or tribal society, war must ultimately take a back seat to the fundamental issues of survival for the original group, so without this division of labor, people engaged in a conflict still had to take time to hunt or take care of other problems on the home front.  This is one of the most compelling reasons why the level of violence would be motivated by such radically different issues.

I personally suspect that many of the acts of violence, such as blood-feuds, probably have more to do with ritual than any intrinsic human behaviors.  Another view, is that periodic skirmishes were simply engaged in to let other groups know that "they were still around" and to ensure that others recognized that they weren't simply going to be "push-overs".  There would certainly be a fair amount of vying for position to fore-stall aggression rather than to engage in it.


Nicholas Horton's picture
Steve, 
you're right that in actuality there isn't the strict dichotomy between the positive and the negative.  That is, most humans live in the gray areas, and more over, any single individuals positions on the continuum between "good" and "evil" are different given various contingencies.  For instance, a person might be rather nice to people when he's bumped into while walking down the street, but flip the bird to anyone who cuts them off while their in the car.  One version of themselves is deferential and forgiving, the other harsh and over-reactive.

Further, every persons tendencies can, and do, change regularly.  So, I would agree that we need to careful when discussing the roots of human violent behavior, and the levels of that behavior in the modern population.  Like you said, even chimps are complex enough to be able to display cultural differences among different groups.  But, hey, that's part of what makes the study of human behavior so interesting!  It's so complicated.

Gerard,
While total annihilation isn't a common feature of conflictual situations, it isn't unheard of.  Certain chimp groups have displayed this type of behavior, and there is archeological evidence that humans have been doing it for a long time (pre-agricultural).  That said, it really isn't the norm.  Not even in modern warfare.  The Romans prefered to assimilate people, enslave them, and tax them to death.  In all the centuries of warfare between England and France, neither side explicitly made it their goal to wipe the other off the face of the earth.  And we Americans aren't trying to wipe the Iraqi's off the earth either (well, the guys on the 700 club are!).   Like you said, it wouldn't be in the interest of the group committing the annihilation in most cases. 

That begs the question:  What are the conditions under which animal groups and human groups will engage in these extreme behaviors?  And, where does this tendency come from?

When we talk about blood revenge killings, I'm reminded of victims of violent crimes here in the US.  There is a reason we don't put victims on the Jury.  They cease to be able to think rationally in relation to the crime and are prone to over-reaction.   Emotions and their ability to cloud our judgment play a major role in certain behaviors under duress.

It seems to me that this discussion has brought to light a clear need to differentiate between different forms of violence in some way so that the research on their prevalence and their evolutionary (both genetic and cultural) origins can be better understood.  There's been a flurry of great research in altruism in the last 20 or 30 years.  But, I haven't found the same for the negative side of human behavior.  It's out there, but it's not as sophisticated. 

Gerhard Adam's picture
Not to split hairs, but my point about total annihilation was to illustrate that it could be an objective (and is in many cases; i.e. terrorism).  Invariably the point of modern warfare is to engage as long as necessary to either annihilate the enemy or bring about unconditional surrender. 

In short, these two elements could never be entertained by the more rudimentary warfare of tribal societies.

As you mentioned the Romans, it illustrates my point perfectly since it was largely their invention to field professional armies.  Even talking about assimilation, slavery, etc. are all forms of "annihilation" if the identity of the original people and their territory cease to exist.

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