Track your comments!
[x]


When you register, comments on your articles and replies to your comments appear here. Register Now!

Sign in to your account
[x]

Not a Scientific Blogging member yet?

Register Now for a Free Scientificblogging.com Account

  • Customize your profile with pictures, banner, a blogroll and more.
  • Leave comments on articles, add other members to your friend lists, chat with people on the site.
  • Write blog posts that can be seen by hundreds of thousands of readers.

It's free and it only takes a minute!

Already a Scientific Blogging member?

Sign In Now

Fake Banner
By Robert H Olley | January 28th 2009 03:50 AM | 13 comments | Print | E-mail | Track Comments
.

More Beamlines articles

All

About Robert H Olley

I work in the Polymer Physics Group of the Physics Department at the University of Reading.

I would describe myself as a Polymer Morphologist. I am not an astronaut, but I am a "Real


... Full Bio

I like stirring, so here is this recent University Press Release (27 January 2009):

'Censoring' language is key to female survival in the boardroom


New research from the University of Reading argues that women leaders have to be language experts to survive the rigours of the boardroom.

Women learn to censor their language to be accepted by their male colleagues but the effort for some could be too much, and is part of the reason why women remain seriously under-represented in UK boardrooms.


Comments

Hank's picture
But this applies to all people, not just women.     How many times have you been in a meeting with someone brazenly stupid but instead you said something like, "That's an interesting idea but we should consider ..."  rather than "I just felt my IQ drop listening to you ..." ?

So "men learn to censor their language to be accepted ..." wouldn't get any press releases (or funding) but it's just as true.

Becky Jungbauer's picture
True. But, you are a guy - and as the article points out, you would be praised for your inclusive and cooperative language. I read the press release and recognized a lot of what I do in business situations - I knew that it made people more receptive but I didn't realize females have to develop that as a survival mechanism. I thought it was just being tactful. Personally I'd rather people be straight with me - if you told me your IQ dropped while listening to me, I'd laugh, probably punch you in the face, and get over it and cast that idea out of my head. Then again, I'm not brazenly stupid. :)

Gerhard Adam's picture

At the risk of really opening a can of worms, let me offer another perspective.  Admittedly this is purely speculative, but if we consider some of this from a biological viewpoint it might provide a bit of insight.

Biologically the genders compete with each other for partners so the means by which they can express ideas to each other is equally different.   For example, when men compete with each other (for females)they may exhibit cooperation or aggression, but this would be interpreted differently than when a woman is equally aggressive (since it would imply rejection).  Similarly if women criticize each other, this would be viewed much differently than if a man leveled the same criticism.

I realize that the business environment is supposed to be blind to these things, and arguably they shouldn't occur in this context, but I'm not completely sure we can escape from these ingrained attitudes.  One is reminded of how male animals may show aggression to each other when competing for a mate, and then wonder what would happen should a female animal suddenly display similar traits.  I suspect this would be a completely baffling experience to the animals involved, since there is no context in which to interpret such behavior.

Just from my own perspective, when men talk aggressively or cooperatively there are numerous subtleties that may be involved because of experiences growing up (whether it be fighting at school, etc.)  As a result, there is a masculine subtext of violence (even if it never manifests) that is implicit in every exchange.  The way a male deals with anger, insults, responses, etc are all wrapped up in this psychology, so when a woman moves into that role, the male doesn't have any context with which to interpret this. 


I realize you were joking (at least somewhat) when you said "punch you in the face", that has a definite meaning and connotation to males that is not joking.  The vast majority of men on hearing that from a woman don't take it seriously, because there is a general sense that women shouldn't be hit, so (1) there is no real perceived threat and (2) a woman that attempted it would be viewed as simply annoying.  This is certainly not the response she might expect, but nevertheless it would be real.



Becky Jungbauer's picture
No can of worms opened, don't worry. :) And yes, I was completely kidding when I said I would punch him. I was trying to be "aggressive" and play off the article. You had some really interesting observations. I'm curious - why would female aggression be seen as rejection, whether in humans or animals?

Gerhard Adam's picture
Well ... if you consider men competing with each other for a woman's attention, then the presumption would be that the winner may find a "receptive" female.  Aggression by the woman towards the "winner" would be viewed as a rejection and the "contest" would continue.

Among animals, female aggression towards a courting male is rejection.

Hank's picture
She's not kidding.   You had better go find a safe place too.

Gerhard Adam's picture
I don't think she can trace the IP address I'm at this week .... after this perhaps ... witness protection?

Becky Jungbauer's picture
There is no safe place. I have people everywhere.

Gerhard Adam's picture
Then I must trust your kindness ... :)

Becky Jungbauer's picture
I'm secretly a big softie, so you're safe. Plus you like science and have a sense of humor, so you're doubly safe. Aren't too many of us in this world.

Gerhard Adam's picture

Just to extend the explanation a bit, many women wonder why men equate female aggression with being a b**ch.  If you consider what I mentioned previously that aggression signified rejection, then for a male that is not courting or vying for attention, then female aggression seems unjustified and brings out the sense of resentment.


Bear in mind that a significant part of the issue is that women often don't realize how many elements of relationships depend exclusively on their decisions.  While I realize that this is a significant generalization, social etiquette and the law both reflect the fact that virtually every interaction between a man and a woman is ultimately up to the woman to establish the boundaries and the man is expected to honor that.  Once again, then female aggression (in a neutral context) is viewed as unjustified hostility and not in the same vein as men amongst themselves.

This is not to say that men make no decisions in relationships, or that women can't be rejected, but rather that the woman must decide the direction any action takes first.  Also, that doesn't mean there aren't extremes on all sides with obsessive behaviors, but if we look at normal circumstances then I think some of these perspectives might provide some insight.



Becky Jungbauer's picture
Ok, that makes sense. I was interpreting aggression to mean confidence, which is often confused in women, I think. I've been told that I come across occasionally as one of those b-words because I am confident in my abilities and look people in the eye and have a firm handshake. I never understood that - how can confidence be interpreted as b**chy? I am not a violent person at all, unless you're threatening my life, so I never thought of myself as aggressive. But I can see how people interpret actions and words differently depending on their personal context. I shall refrain from all aggressive overtures from now on. Ok, I won't, but I won't mean them as threats to your person. Unless you're between a hot fudge brownie sundae and me. Then all bets are off.

Gerhard Adam's picture

After a sigh of relief, I've sworn off hot fudge brownie sundaes.



Add a comment

The content of this field is kept private and will not be shown publicly.
  • Allowed HTML tags: <sup> <sub> <a> <em> <strong> <center> <cite> <code> <TH><ul> <ol> <li> <dl> <dt> <dd> <img> <br> <p> <blockquote> <strike> <object> <param> <embed> <del> <pre> <b> <i> <table> <tbody> <div> <tr> <td> <h1> <h2> <h3> <h4> <h5> <h6> <hr> <iframe>
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
CAPTCHA
If you register, you will never be bothered to prove you are human again. And you get a real editor toolbar to use instead of this HTML thing that wards off spam bots.